If anyone is interested, Adam responded on Twitter.
This is something I want to learn more about… I’m not sure it will be particularly actionable as I don’t think I’ll actively work on changing my path…
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When you play a fade, you have to open the face to path. This produces a higher spin loft (difference between AOA and dynamic loft).
Even if you putt he ball back in the stance, it lowers the loft, but also steepens the AOA an equal amount, so you almost can’t get away with it.
So I would say that, intra-player, a draw goes longer than a fade. However, inter-player, many players can fade it longer than drawers for many reasons.
I “can” get my fade to go as long as my draw, but I have to change more variables consciously in my swing. For example, I would have to try and Len the shaft forwards more while shallowing the angle of attack out with a fade (and those two foci are counter to each other).
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Awesome! This makes a ton of sense and is very helpful…
Good luck with your new student! I’m excited to see how season 4 of Chasing Scratch goes.
Kudos to you!
I have worked out how to hit a powerful fade. I have my in to out swing path and open the face. Aim down the left and hit a straight shot that falls to the right at the end. Have the face a little less open and hit a draw.
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If I understand path correctly, you can’t hit a fade and be in to out… it sounds like your path is just barely off neutral, and you come in slightly out to in on your stock shot…
I’ve always felt the same way with my swing… stock shot I leave the face open, draw I close the face… that’s what prompted this thread!
I’m really looking forward to getting some time in a simulator.
So technically it must be a push fade. With the same swing if I don’t open the face I hit a hook. I have a standard left hand grip but my right hand slips around the side of the grip. Then when I swing I open the face on the back swing till my right hand is under the shaft and through impact the right hand slides under and powers my drive. I am definitely not out to in. I am too much in to out.
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No idea! I don’t know what all the different shots are or all the possible combos… I’m still learning all this stuff on path and I’m still not confident in any of it.
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I have a hard time wrapping my head around some of the path-to-face relationships and resulting shot shapes as well. My buddy told me that the way DJ “fades” the ball is not the way average golfers “fade” the ball, i.e. that DJ is somehow swinging just slightly in-to-out but that his driver face is just slightly open to his path, which results in a powerful, mostly straight ball flight that just falls gently to the right at the end. In other words, he is not wiping across the ball with an out-to-in path where the ball starts off pulled to the left and then spins a lot back into the fairway. I don’t know, hard to get your mind around, but I think I get it.
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Yeah. I’m still not sure on it… need to google it and read some more. It’s honestly the reason I started this thread, as I thought I understood the basics and then listened to @Jon s podcast and got confused again (not through Jon’s fault, I just don’t clearly understand this stuff).
I’m trying to gain a better understanding of it still…
As @Adamyounggolf says above with a out to in path to hit a powerful fade you need a shallow attack and a forward leaning shaft. I get that with a delayed hit as the hands drop from the top to almost behind me and I pivot and with feeling of the right hand slipping under the shaft I hit, aiming at the left rough but flying down the middle and falling to the right. I don’t think I could get the same distance if I swung out to in. I know my swing is not a model to be copied but I am making it work for me.
@okiwiz This is where I get confused… I really just need to get onto a launch monitor and try to achieve the different variables…
I don’t know if your buddy is right or not about DJ, but but an in-to-out swing with a clubface aimed right of the path will cause a shot that starts out (approximately) where the face is aimed (a little right of the path) and curve further right. If DJ wants to hit the fairway with that shot, he’d need to set up slightly open, so that his (in-to-out) path is still left of his intended landing point. You can hit a fade with an in-to-out path, or a draw, or a straight shot. If you set up square, swing in-to-out, with a clubface open to the path, your shot will start right and go further right. I know, I have that shot, among a few others.
@Adamyounggolf has it absolutely right on his website, the ball starts about where the clubface is aimed, and curves away from the path. That happens whether the path is in-to-out or out-to-in.
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Yeah, that makes sense, and I think that may be what DJ does. Aims up the left with an open stance and bombs away!
Saw this pic today which reminded me of this thread. Really helpful for me, and I thought it was worth sharing!
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This is super helpful! Thanks.
Such an important concept to understand, thanks for sharing!
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cheers to that! Practice manual is great. My kids will be starting youth sports in a few years and I think it The Practice Manual will be one of the biggest influences on how I coach.
Great visual. I am currently working on making sure my pattern only produces E, G, and H!!
Unfortunately, I am good for most of these shapes on any given swing!
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Ok, so I should have just bought the practice manual months ago… in two sentences it fixed my confusion…
If the club face is open to the path, the ball will curve right. If the club face is closed to the path, the ball will curve left…
That makes sense!
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Precisely. Once you get that it’s easy to diagnose the why of a shot.
Hot pull hook into the woods? My clubface was closed to a path that was fairly neutral or outside in.
Push slice? My face was open to a path to neutral or inside out path.
Perfect baby draw (my shot of choice when I’m on), face ever so slightly closed to the path which is inside out to some extent (roughly 4-5 degrees for me)
Bam! Physics!
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