I think learning more about the evolution of the rules is helpful in understanding the Rules we have now. There’ve been a lot of changes since the first set of 13 Rules was written down in 1744.
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It’s definitely interesting, and to a certain extent it’s funny how complicated “Play the ball as it lies, and leave the course as you found it” becomes in the real world.
As I’ve started reading more about the 2019 changes, it definitely seems like they are trying to make things more streamlined, which is good…
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Thanks Dave, to be fair, the level of competition I play in, the examples I give are very unlikely to be challenged, and i certainly wouldn’t call them out. I did have one playing partner warm me that my practice swing and nearly hit a branch and if it dislodged even a single leaf it could be a penalty that said.
Glad you understand it all!
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I don’t claim to understand it all, but I keep trying to learn a little more all the time.
To me, the single leaf thing seems excessively strict, I’m not sure removing one leaf would improve the Conditions Affecting the Swing. But 20 leaves might, so a line has to be drawn somewhere. I believe that rules work best when they’re clear and specific, so that they can be consistently enforced. When judgements need to be made, there will inevitably be a variability in the judgements that different players will make, and that’s not equitable.
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I agree, it needs to consistent, which is always the really hard part with any sports rules.
I do find this sort of discussion really interesting and would like to eventually be able to say I know the rules of golf…
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Its a journey, at least it has been for me, but the more I learn, the more I want to continue learning. A good spot to start is here:
https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules-hub/a-short-course-on-the-rules.html
I remember you had concerns about Rule 8, the first video in that series deals with Playing the Course as You Find It. It looks like the video is only about 13 minutes long.
If I had one huge bugaboo that really kills me are divots in the fairway, especially ones that aren’t replaced. This is in a fairway not in the rough! Have you ever played in a match where you are struggling off the tee, you finally hit the fairway, things are finally coming together…you get up to your ball and it comes to rest in someones non-replaced attempt to find buried treasure. Especially the non-replaced stuff 10 yds down from the divot that the inconsiderate player made. That is one rule, I truly think should be changed to GUR automatically. I mean in non tourney play our super asks us to drop with no penalty in areas that are not going to affect the earth trying to repair itself instead of us tearing an even bigger hole and scarring the turf even more. Players should be rewarded for doing what is supposed to be done, not punished. I have never felt that was “rub of the green”. I think that’s an ancient rule, like the stymie that just needs to be changed! Just my feelings on that subject. I guess you can tell that has affected me more than my fair share.
How do you decide which holes are GUR and which aren’t? what if you are in a small depression that is a divot hole that is about 90% recovered? Should you get relief from that? In that case, how can you be sure it’s an old divot hole?
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I’ve been thinking about this too much now… and have a few conflicting thoughts.
My first thought is: is this really an issue that needs fixing on a major level? I feel like we can fix the problem for weekend warriors with a local rule and let the pros deal with it…
My second thought is: If we just gave anyone who wanted it a free drop in the fairways, would it make much of a difference? especially on the pro level? Modern fairways tend to be pretty smooth, so I can’t see allowing people to take a drop really impacting a round all that much.
Any my third thought goes back to my first: Shouldn’t golf be a game of playing the ball where it lies? (and then we get back to the 2nd thought of, we have plenty of rules that break the spirit of playing the ball where it lies… who am I to draw a new arbitrary line?)
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We play our own local rule.
You can roll the ball within one scorecard in the fairway. No big deal in local game.
For tournament stroke play though, play the ball down
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Does that drop include cleaning the ball? that can make a big difference.
What are those rules? Seems to me, when I’m playing, I only touch my ball when it’s on the green or when it’s affected by a man made obstruction, virtually all of which did not exist when the idea of play the ball down was devised (cart paths, drain covers, sprinkler heads, etc).
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99% of golfers who hit a ball in a fairway know what a divot is, obviously a ball that’s in a depression, or one that lodges into a ground hornet hole speaks for itself and is a free drop. First, it really irritates me when people don’t repair divots or ball marks in a fairway. My argument is not hitting the ball into the rough, “we don’t belong there” unless your ball plugs, or is in tire tracks…play it as you find it. Today most fairways are looking quite manicured, I’d love my lawn to look that way. I just don’t feel a player should be penalized for hitting a fairway, clean it, drop it, play it…and YES it makes that much of a difference. 
Wanna have some fun…Play stymies one day with your friends. Wanna see some arguments. Especially if someone has 3ft put for birdie on your butt…Then you’ll see how & why ancient rules get changed and should be changed. And how with a stymie, great shots weren’t always rewarded. And yes, it was actually part of the game and a good putter could use it to their advantage BIG TIME!..remember hitting your opponents ball on the green is a penalty too! Loss of hole in match play! 1 stroke in medal play!
any and all divots your ball falls into in a fairway only, you should not be punished for hitting a fairway, the game is hard enuff…that’s just my opinion
Those are more or less the rules I was talking about, all move away from playing the ball as it lies (which is fine! I don’t really care either way… I think it makes sense to be able to move the ball sometimes, but adding the word SOMETIMES into a set of rules creates areas of doubt and require interpretation which then allows people to bend the rules and break the spirit…)
Divots existed in golf when the rules were first written (I assume)… so moving the ball out of a divot could have easily been a rule when they were first created… It wasn’t, as playing it down was the idea when things were first created… That doesn’t mean we can’t or shouldn’t change things now, though.
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Playing with stymies can be fun but it also introduces an idea of playing defense against your opponent which isn’t really part of the game. Whether it should or shouldn’t be part of the game, I don’t think an opponent’s ball is part of the playing conditions in the same way that the ground, with all its imperfections, is. Hitting into a divot is a bummer but hitting out is a skill and if it happens frequently, one that can really differentiate yourself.
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This bit shows why an understanding of the history of the game and of the rules helps in understanding the rules as they are today. Divots existed well before the first rules were written down. Players didn’t expect “perfection”, they dealt with whatever lie their ball ended up in. Almost all of the free relief situations we have now are due to artificial things which were introduced later on, or for conditions like embedded balls or casual water which became more common as golf expanded into different areas, different geologies, different terrains. But all along, divots have been part of the game. I don’t see a good way to write an enforceable rule allowing relief, and don’t see this happening frequently enough that it should be explored.
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In our local game, no cleaning the ball unless we have clearly decided to play lift clean and place. Roll the ball with the club.
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Why has your group decided to allow improved lies? Are the fairways rough shape? Do you roll it everywhere through the green?