Rules, morals and spirit of the game

General Discussion
#29

Correct, Correct and Correct. All were done in accordance as stated above. Just to make the #1 instance even more interesting… We reported the first instance, my playing partners (competitors) said we would have granted him relief, but he played 2 balls. And when that was done, I played one out, then went back and played from a mark. The referee went out and said… I wouldn’t have granted relief in that circumstance. So my first ball was the only one that would have counted anyways… I did score 4 on both balls in that instance. The second instance, this was like a 8inch wide 3 - 4 inch deep, looked like a spin out in the center of the first cut. It did prevent my ball from going into the 3 inch rough. Ball was marked, closest point of relief probably was into the fw, but it was equidistant if I kept the drop into the first cut, really was a close call. If I would have dropped into the 3 inch high rough 1 club length, my stance would have been in that rut, so that was definitely out. Pretty sure we did everything properly. Everyone and the referee was comfortable with drop. Mostly the second instance, and it’s not like they have travelling referees in these local events, like you see in the pros… you make your best effort to be in compliance. Hey if the drop had to be in the rough that’s what we would have made it. We all try and make our best call. Know what I mean? It was bad enough declaring I’ll play 2 balls as that slowed down play as it was.

In our saturday rounds, we play the local rules, we had a local rule for a while, when there were no rakes out and you ended up in a bunker, you could lift, smooth out the area with your foot or club, and place the ball on the smoothed out area. I’ve had rules look like they would hurt like I was entitled to a drop from a path, but the closest point of relief was into bushes! So I sucked it up and scraped up a 5 iron.

1 Like
#30

I’d forgo the rules when the golf ball is near roots tree trunks, boulders… If nothing is riding on the outcome of the shot. Why risk injury or damaged equipment?
I had to fix a guy’s 5 iron last month because the shaft snapped upon impact during the follow through on a tree trunk. He was playing with his S-I-L and a round of drink was riding on the outcome of the game.
It cost him plenty to re-shaft it.
More than a few rounds of drink, and he also risked of injuring someone when the broken shaft with the head helicoptered to 10’ away.
I for one will not take off my golf shoes to hit a shot submerged in water, even a friendly bet is on the table.

1 Like
#31

I agree with you, if not playing a competition go ahead and move it. If playing a competition, by the rules, take Unplayable Ball relief, or take your chances. The rules don’t require anyone to risk injury, its only their own stubbornness that leads to that.

2 Likes
#32

Or as I remembered, have volunteers to remove the obstruction.
Tiger Woods had a situation where a good sized boulder might be interfering with the golf swing. There were a few of the spectator who carried the boulder away from his swing path. It was on Television with one of the tournaments broadcasting. Not sure if that is a violation of the rules where the golfer did not ask for the act but it was performed anyway.

1 Like
#33

Now and then, a Loose Impediment can be removed by any means available, if its done with excessive delay to play. But if you cannot remove it, thats life, keep it out of the desert.

2 Likes
#34

Yes, I remember seeing 3-4 strong men lifting that small piece of boulder to clear the way for Tiger. Amazing. Bethpage Black?

#35

I’m thinking it was either Arizona or Palm Springs, but I’m way too lazy to Google it for myself

#36

You’re correct, it was in Phoenix. It amazed me that the fans could help in this situation without breaking the rules.

#37

I completely agree with that sentiment, but I’m not playing to maintain a handicap.

But, and this is strictly imo…

For people who are maintaining a handicap, I’m wondering if actions like that … along with others such as moving your ball out of a fairway divot … are contrary to “the spirit of the game”…

1 Like
#38

If one is not depending on the outcome of this one round of score to bring his index down a half a point. Why do it? Even in tournament golf, we’d witness professionals assessing the situation then either go ahead or declare unplayable lie. Keep one thing in mind that they have sponsors for their equipment. A trip to the tour van after the round would get the damage shaft or head replaced.
Can’t remember which golfer nor the tournament, but I witness on the media there were quite a few incidents of broken or bent shafts resulted from heroic play.
I do remember Phil Michelson and others hitting off the paved asphalt surface a few times.
As for hitting golf balls in a fairway divot, why abandon a chance to practice such a shot? You won’t find this lie on the modern day driving range mat, and no one practice with this lie on grass tee.
I had several opportunity to practice and confirm on what I learned of hitting from the fairway divot ( not a crater). Take one or two more club hit down and through; the ball will come out a bit lower and mostly with a little curve to the right . Same as hitting a driver off the fairway on a long par 5 ( back a few decades ago when the center of gravity on the driver’s face was much lower on a smaller driver head ). I could pull off a shot with a driver head as large as 410 c.c.
It is a personal choice when playing a recreational round if to hit a wayward tee shot in the jungle, through tree branches to get back on the fairway or toward the green; trying to stop a full swing to avoid a tree trunk ( usually won’t work unless one is extremely strong). Not everyone is Saviano Ballesteros.

1 Like
#39

I agree here. If you don’t want to play the shot due to risk of injury or damage fine but its a one stroke penalty. If its in a divot as Dews says, play it, its the only way you learn how to!

3 Likes
#40

I’ve said it before, the “spirit of the game” means (to me at least) playing by the Rules. All the Rules, not just the convenient ones. Sure, that might mean you’re faced with a choice between potential injury and/or club damage, vs taking a penalty stroke for Unplayable. There’s discussion that free relief is OK in casual rounds, where the score doesn’t really count. But if the score doesn’t really count, why would a player be so concerned about adding a penalty stroke to his score?

2 Likes
#41

I agree. Even in a casual round, I am playing out of a divot or taking an unplayable. Of course there is always a few $$ on our matches so we aren’t letting anyone break the rules lol.

2 Likes
#42

Yes, agreed. You’re either playing golf (as we know it) or you’re playing “Judge Smails ball” :crazy_face::crazy_face::rofl::rofl:

#43

It’s just screwing yourself. Those actions lower your posted score and will therefore show up in your handicap. Your opponent in a match/tournament isn’t likely to let you do it, right. But you’ll be getting strokes as if they would have let you do it.

1 Like
#44

Exactly, and it is not easy to live by all the rules because not every golfer knows every rule in the book and how to "interpret, apply " the rule in a life situation. Not during a non-tournament round without rule official to help.
However, the Brits sneakered at our “winter rules” because they truly play the golf ball where it lies. That will eliminate a lot of the issues. Not lifting even with manmade obstructions. That’s the way this game should be played. I believe and exercise playing the golf ball where it lies, and the result is, many of my golf buddies criticized me of being “too serious with the rules of the game”.

1 Like
#45

There be always someone who knows the truth, well, at least one, yourself.
A handicap index is to reflect your potential ability of scoring, nothing more. It won’t offer you a promotion at work , it won’t shame you among your peer; so if we don’t do it with all the rules and honesty, then, why bother? Use the time for something else that required you to mark down the scores with each hole, calculate it and input it into the handicap system.
I have been always telling my closest friends that if they might as well throw away the score card if the apply personalized altered rules. Unfortunately some need an index to play the weekend club tournaments. We know who they are, so if something like a trophy is on the line ( or Calcutta) , there be someone near by when they take a swing at the golf ball.

1 Like
#46

Agreed :+1:

Wish all golfers felt, and played, the same way … :man_shrugging:

1 Like
#47

Yeah it’s unfortunate that you, and others who hold to the Rules and spirit of the game, have to be distracted monitoring others. Oh well …

Anyway – there have some very interesting thoughts and perspectives listed in here!! :ok_hand:

1 Like
#48

It is quite alright if someone I golf with do a little foot wedge. As long as there is nothing riding on the outcome for my sake. Long ago, golf with a guy who supposed to have machos moola. I spotted him turning the golf ball sitting in the fairway so marker will be pointed at the target line. We were playing a 3 team dollar skin. The winner of 2 skins will probably break even, and might come out covered his green fee if he win the majority of the holes; so not a really big bet but enough to get your attention.
I mentioned this to the guy while we were sitting down in the clubhouse restaurant for lunch to settle the skins. He got angry at me for fingering him out of his cheating, and warned me “you be careful”… LOL. He was an idiot to pull that teenager’s threat on me. I had never golf with that guy since. Heard he got several girl friends later and one of his son grew up to be a good golfer. Hope the son does not behave like his old man on the golf course.
So, they can do anything they wish on the golf course or off the golf course. I just think that one would be stupid enough to expose their true intention to others over a game. Who knows, there might be other situation involving the same people in the future and they’ve already know the cards you’re holding.

1 Like