LOL…video games… you are 100% correct.
My own kids could relate to the video and tech much better than reading a text. Even all of them were avid readers when they were young. We were one of the families who will visit the public library every week.
Maybe, the A.I. will run the world in the future. Simply because the world is changing.
Golf will be reverting back to the game for the elite because there won;t be suitable landscape for golf courses.
During a golf swing, should the left side ( leading side ) or the right side ( trailing side ) be the dominant side for power?
I once asked a fellow golfer this question while waiting on the 10th tee, he then lost his concentration for the inward 9.
I had understand and realized different expression throughout the years of my golf experience.
I was so convinced oat each stage of evolution of my learning. Trouble is, the convicions were not on the same path.
If one looks at all of the best ball-strikers in this game (amateur or pro), they all end up in the same position. You are asking the wrong question and, as your partner found out…who became discombobulated on the Inward 9 as you said when you made him think.
I work very hard on this…for me, a 65 YO amateur, still pumping it out there with a driver 240-250 very consistently I can attest to the LINK Below.
The Master has Spoken!
Below was me in August of 2023, One of my Best of the Year, I’m usually 240-250!
The question was, if your golf swing is dominated by the leading or the trailing side of your body.
Ben Hogan did not answer the question directly, when asked if he swings with the left arm more or with the righ arm.
He did, at one time said something along this line, “I wish I have 2 right arms”.
By watching the video of Mickey Wright, who Ben Hogan said owns the best golf swing, men or women; one should have a good idea of how a golf swing should look like.
I’ll delay my thoughts on this just in case someone else wish to express their side of the observation.
I understand the question. It’s worded wrong. Neither side is dominant. It’s a turn. Hoke Austin used Kinetics to prove this. Mr Hogan also thought the best ball striker he ever saw was Lee Trevino. It was no secret when he forged new irons he would always say to his team, take this down to the Little Mexican guy and let him give you feedback. Lee Buck, BHs Guinea Pig Planting the seed in your playing partners mind should have told you this. There isn’t anything dominant, it’s force and resistance creating speed. Physics calls it a lever & fulcrum. There is no dominant side.
Your levers are the length of your left arm and golf club. If you swing the club back without cocking your wrists you are using one lever (left arm). Adding the second lever (club) by cocking your wrists substantially increases swing arc length and clubhead speed.
With the golf swing the resistance or weight is the clubhead, the fulcrum is the left shoulder and the force is from the body applied to the center of the beam measured as the length of the left arm and clubshaft.
I hope that made sense. I still think your question is worded incorrectly. I have really worked hard to understand the golf swing and how it works.
No it was not worded “wrong”.
Maybe this way you’ll understand a little better.
The age old question posted to Ben Hogan was; did he use more left side coming down from the top or did he use more right side as himself said that he wished he had two right roms?
You were not “wrong” in your assessment and understanding, interpretation of the golf swing. But yoiu had jumped the gun and reached the conclusion before the run is over.
Of course, the weight shift dictates the move from the top. Bben Hogan produced such powerful golf swing from his relatively smaller frame is because he utilized his whole body as the power plant. Same as Lee Travino, Juan Antonio “Chi-Chi” Rodríguez, none of them have the same golf swing, but they all maxed out of what their physical frame could produce.
So which part of the body was “dominating” at which stage of the golf swing?
Obviously, with Hogan’s wish of two right arms, we can assess the right side should be dominating through the golf ball.
Supposed that we comparing the take-away as the first gear of shifting gears in a manual transmission, the coiling up on the top of the swing is the second gear, and the starting of the transition down is the third. Should be more “dominating” with the leading side.
The leading and the trailing side should be working together ( coming together) when accelerating into the impact.
Then the high gear should be taking over by the trailing side while accelrating through the impact as the high gear for more speed.
Or have I lost you , again?
BH always felt it was the hips and lower body that initiated both the the back swing and downswing. In Five Lessons Hogan makes a very interesting statement about the hands, a comment to which you are referring to as arms. “As far as applying power goes, I wish that I had three right hands,” he writes. His natural left-handedness enabled him to support the club through impact, and his open clubface coming into impact allowed him to hit as aggressively as possible with the right hand without fear of it taking over. Although Hogan may have felt it was his right hand, he was actually using his whole right side, and maybe the statement should have been “three right sides.” Not only was his right hand involved with hitting the ball, but so were his right foot, knee, hip, arm and shoulder. This is a great thought, and for players in a good position halfway down, the right side should play a major role in the hit–just like throwing a ball, as Hogan describes.
Again, physics and the understanding of how a lever and fulcrum work is Hogan’s “secret sauce”. Yes you have to bash balls to get the correct sequence to maximize the speed and power YOU can create with your body. I still wouldn’t use the word dominant as I am saying above…it’s a total release of the right side. BH felt it was his hand was delivering the blow, and it was, but coming down it’s the entire right side, I was bought up with the notion of weight shift, I no longer subscribe to that swing thought. My current thought is one of a vertical see-saw, where the faster I can turn is how you can “step on the gas” creating power.
When we look at a picture, not two will come up with the same conclusion. You will have to learn to accept others poiint of view, or you will never be a good teacher or mentor for the others.
This is one of my weakness. I would tell my point of view until proven wrong. Before that fact, I’m like most of us, rooted in the way of our experience. Unlike the younger generation, who will gather information and use it as the Bible.,
Ben Hogan had disclosed his “secret” throughout the years of his articles and books, but golfers were still chasing after a “secret”.
There is no doubts, to do any atheletic move, one must involve the whole body, same as in martial arts , same as any sports.
What the quote from Ben Hoan meant with the “I wish I have two right arms” was more refined than just to use the whole body and power from the ground up.
As I had mentioned, this is involving the last move into the impact, after all the coil-up, starting from the ground up (push with the feet, hence he had an extra spike in his golf shoes). … The last rev into the impact by him and from my experience is the trailing side to give that little extra ( arm and hand being the last link of the involvement from the tailing side).
I’d learned this long ago, way before I had become a Hogan Fan. While witnessing an assitant golf professional taking on bets from fellow range rats. A couple of frequents at the driving range bet him that he could not reach the flag posted at 179 yards with an 8 iron ( mind you, this was in the early 80s, so the loft and length of that 8 iron was about the same as today’s 9 iron if not weaker )…
Randy took that bet and with some warm up , he calmly put the range ball over that flag and took the bet.
As he said “thank you gentlemen for the lunch”, one guy asked how could he do that… Randy answered, “because I know how to use my hands” .
This observation influenced my golf game from the beginning.
If you need a little octane to go a few yards longer, try to practice and learn how to use your trailing arm and hand at the right moment. That is the turbo boost for a little more distance as you are looking to gain a little more driver distance.
Harmon, Haney, Leadbetter, Como all great coaches. Here’s the funny thing about this game they all have formulated all different ways to get to the same place. Most of them will have their beliefs in THEIR system and think the other guys are full of it. If they didn’t, teaching would all be the same, wouldn’t matter who you went to. That’s how money is made. Just to repeat myself, they all have different methods to get to the same place. After my injuries, I went back to the drawing board, I had lost a tremendous amount of distance. I went back to my notes from 40 years ago. A lot of it was talking about weight transfer, I started working and lost more distance. This is when I began to break it down to minutia. My personal discovery had me go back to Hogan and Austin. For me, my philosophy changed, being older I truly had to figure out the engine of the swing. I was no longer a Ferrari, I was a diesel engine, I needed to really employ the hips and lower body, a proper turn allows me to wind up, Sequencing on the downswing, I finally figured out the lower body begins to unwind before I reach the pinnacle of my shoulder turn back, I pretty much just turn, Their is no dominant side for me. When I do share info with other seniors at the course it’s all about the turns, wind up and unwind. When I hit the ball (IMPACT), YES, I’m trying hit the ball with my right hand as hard as I can with my left hand holding on and the back of my left hand is going towards my target line. I truly don’t feel anything being dominant, Turning, not swaying, unwinding, not shifting any weight, I’m trying to transfer built up horsepower to that club head nothing else. That’s what I teach today. Especially for older players.
Same method may or may not work for everyone.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with your golf game if you’re happy with it; same method or advice will not work for every golfer.
If you believe what you’re enjoying your golf game at your current level then so be it.
Not many will seek and accept assistence when they’re settled into their state of game. Especially those advice which came free of charge instead of $150-$200 per 30 minutes.
Well that was a pretty uncalled for slap! At one time I was a teaching professional. I actually went to school, passed the PAT with a score of 149 then gave up my dream to raise a family. Most Golf Professionals are NOT Scratch Golfers. They don’t get to play or practice that much, they are busy doing other things like catering to a membership. My foray into that was running outings & tournaments, running the cash register, Cleaning & putting carts away and plugging them in every nite… very few lessons (which is where you make your money) Locking up the Pro-Shop. I was lucky to be making $23K annually. Anywhere in there did you hear playing in the 6 months I gave that a whirl. It was a choice to give that up. I attained Am status back, I was able to play more and actually give lessons and get paid for it. Wanna know what we mostly taught? THE 5 MODERN FUNDAMENTALS as written by Mr. Hogan & Mr Wind. It’s a package usually of 5 lessons and a playing lesson. When the boys in the over 60 club at my course, began to notice that I have picked up not 10, not 20, not 30, not 40, but upwards of 50 yards on my Tee Balls… people kinda notice and begin to ask questions. Many of the boys would be happy just to gain 10-15 yards, I got a couple on the program to understand what the true engine of the swing is and when they hit a ball 210-220 off the tee instead of 180-190. They are very content. Doing it comes with work on their part, not mine. I just show them the slight change in philosophy of the turn, unwind and release, as opposed to thinking weight transference. Again, asking a question of which side is dominant is already confusing to anyone. You would tell me that Harmon might preach one thing and Leadbetter another? No how, no way! I appreciate the OP. The real question is, how does one get their possible 92% to 97% maximum force on every full swing into that clubhead at impact. I, as many others have, came to the conclusion, assuming grip is solid, address is solid and on line with a target, the engine of the swing is the lower body, and the hips turn as far they can without the right leg swaying off it’s address position and the shoulders and arms follow that, the second part of the swing, downswing is started by the process of you unwinding the hips the other way and that will begin to happen just before your shoulders and arms reach their pinnacle on the backswing. As the hips are already beginning to clear, the hands, arms and shoulders unwind transferring energy into the shaft and clubhead. The center of the body is very stationary until after impact when your finish should bring you on your left leg. I get what you are trying to say, I still don’t think that is the proper way to think about it. I would say: Is it the Lower Body and Hips giving the power on the downswing or is it the upper body Shoulders and Arms? The right side, nor left side have no influence on the turn. In the 90’s when Daly entered the scene, the dominant conversation was that of the X Factor, people like Daly who could turn 105*+ instead of 90*-94*. A proper turn back (wind-up) and turn back the opposite way (un-wind). It’s not a transference of weight by the body per se, it’s the transference of energy into that clubhead at impact of a golf ball. AND we all should be swinging as if the ball isn’t even there, it’s just something that gets in the way. Some guys, tee it high, some low, some play a ball towards the middle of a stance, others more to the front, To me, that’s what works for you…100 ways from Sunday to discuss those things.
Let me put it simple to you.
there is no two martial arts schools will agree on the principle of the art and who reigns supremacy. As well as the teaching for the sports of golf.
This is one of the major reason why I admire Harvey Penick so much, not just because of his teaching, his principle of not over charging but because of his open mind approach to other teaching method.
He may not agree with a shut-face take away but he was “fascinated” with the different style and wanted to discuss and learn from it.
The cookie cutter PGA school of teaching is good in the general sense, mostly for the beginners. This is why the professional golfers would not seek help from just any teaching person to help them back on track.
If someone had pointed out a way to better your golf game and you’ll deny it before even giving it a chance to prove that this particulat method will not work for your individual need, then you are not going to improve, period.
I’m as aged or might be older than you are, but, I’m always seeking a better way of doing things, including golf. The only caveat is that when I recognized the path will lead to the wrong destination, by experience and seen that been there.
You disagreed with the trailing hands will be the last boost to power? Perhaps that is exactly why so many top golfers injured their fingers and hands before the other major injury.
The teaching of using core is correct and foremost, but the last turbo boost with hands is something a novice could not comprehand.
Of course, how to use the hands is another topic and better to demonstrate than words could deliver.
Why do you think the golf grip is the first thing of most the teaching? I’ll let you drill on that since you were a teaching professional.
Look, I don’t mind the lively debate, and I don’t mind sticking to my guns, but let’s keep it at a debate, and not fling tropes like you posted below…Yes, it reads as an insult!
Actually my son is a 2nd degree black belt in TangSooDo. And all TangSooDo schools teach the exact same forms and principles and although you call it martial arts, the differing schools like Taekwondo do NOT end up in the same place other than they teach self defense. The Haney School, may teach something slightly different than the Harmon School, but all those schools will lead you up to the same place. So don’t compare Apples to Oranges. I said nothing regarding anything except that to teach one side is more dominant than the other is not true. Nothing about hands, only sequence delivering a blow to a golf ball. What is the last lever in the golf swing? Hands/Wrist. And, as I said, we concentrated on GRIP when we did group lessons in LESSON #1. You even said you got a golfer to start thinking about it those terms and he couldn’t hit another shot for the rest of his round in the OP or am I wrong? So, why did that discombobulate the golfer you mentioned it to? I say…. Because it’s a wrong premise. You tell me sir, which is the dominant side and tell me why and what is happening throughout the swing to say either the Left or Right side is more dominant??? It’s not an opinion, when you say one or the other it has to make sense physically. So for me, I kind of look at it this way the turns of the lower body and hips are the engine and the turns of the arms and shoulders are the gas pedal. When those 2 pieces work in synch, the results are easily seen. Teaching that is easy, making someone execute that within their physical abilities takes work on their part. So for arguments sake, you are saying left side or right side and which is dominant throughout the swing process. I am saying upper body and lower body with neither being dominant, but working in synch with each other and at one point working directly opposite of each other once you perfect your moves in the process
Not going to pick sides here, but I will state that our ability to analyze forces, ball flight, and body positioning, has all tremendously improved since the days of Hogan and Jack Grout, and even Leadbetter.
Doesn’t necessarily invalidate what they wrote then (But see, that we had that “whole face starts it, path bends it,” thing back-asswards.) But it does say that we might need to add some context from things like GEARS, pressure-plate work, etc.