I agree 100% walkers PLAY faster in general. Cart golfers socializing too much but the cart allows them to move from point to point faster.
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When I play…in between shots, I’m trying not to think about what I can screw up next. Walkers in general form a str8 line to their ball. We generally watch where our playing partners ball go. Good Shots usually get a “nice shot” quote. Poor ones get a chuckle and a needle. When we make a BIrdie, Eagle or Par…no whoops and hollers, just good hole…you’re up followed by usually a very friendly derogatory term. Or look, don’t make birdies if you can’t get up for your honors…LOL…all in fun. But, in general, it’s not about speed rounds, it’s about proper pace of play. People watch too much TV and emulate players…I just love the folks that emulate camillo villegas…
This can be avoided. I’ve been the walker in the group of three riding. You just need to pay attention, be ready to move when everyone has hit, and find creative ways to get to your ball. If I’m closest to the green, I’ll frequently walk outside the rough in the trees to get even with my ball. When everyone after me has hit, I’m generally no more than 30 seconds to my ball.
Same thing on the green. If you’re not the last guy in the hole, it’s a good idea to violate normal etiquette and start walking towards the next tee. If I’m on a course with a long walk between a green and the following tee, I’ve hooked a ride to the tee with the guy riding solo.
I’ve played rounds in 3:15 doing this. Walking alone, I comfortably play 18 in 2:25. Many years ago at Pinehurst, I played about 12 holes on No. 5 in a cart in about 40 minutes–but I was flying because it was a short day in February and I wanted to get in some more golf before dark. I specifically chose to go out on No. 5 because I knew there weren’t many golfers on the course and many of them had teed off hours earlier.
The Scots regularly play in groups of four walking, and a three-hour round is the norm over there. I can’t imagine anyone saying that they enjoy a round of golf where they have to wait on a lot of tees and fairways for the group in front to clear. I’ve found that you can start running into that phenomenon when the rounds stretch out to 4:30 or longer.
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My course has some severe elevation changes, and a few holes where the greens aren’t close to the next tees… if you play it smart walking, you can easily keep up with 2 guys in a cart… especially if those guys aren’t trying to move as fast as possible.
Honestly, I think the walking pace is about right for a course… you aren’t rushing every shot, have some time to think between each shot and get to see the course. If you are paying attention and move when you can, it’s easy to get around in 3 hours walking.
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Hey, hey, hey… we old guys won’t be around that much longer 
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I play with two older guys and they make me hustle… they don’t sit idly by and have no problem moving while others are hitting…
If one guy didn’t stop to light a cigarette every hole is never have a prayer.
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Interesting! We’re considering a system that will send messages to carts as soon as they fall a predetermined amount behind. It’ll let them know how much behind (or ahead) of pace they are. This will be in conjunction with a map that shows the golf shop exactly where each group is. I’m curious what happens with the PoP clocks at your course that leads you to this observation.
The PoP clocks are set at 4:15. Rangers on the course used to tell groups no more than 1 hole of daylight between groups. For instance my group, me as a walker and 3 riders we are a no nonsense group Hit, Chase, Find, Hit again. We play golf, it does not need to be at a turtle’s pace. We have seen as much as a 3 hole gap between us and the group behind us. Last week we got stuck behind a group on our 3rd 9 that had 4 holes open in front of them, but the PoP clocks said on time. Our 3rd nine today had a fairly open course in front of us. Teed off 12:10pm, In the clubhouse having lunch @ 1:45…Scores for the were 36, 39, 42 between the 3 of us. So I say it’s the worse thing, because PoP can be arbitrary…4:15 is a very slow round for many.
I’d say in that situation it’s more about allowing speedy groups like yours to play through as opposed to playing faster. 4:15 might be a bit too long, but if a group is meeting the standard then there’s nothing to complain about IMO. Might be playing a competitive match or be their only chance to get out and play during the week, so milking the time can be understandable.
Issue is the standard used to be no more than one hole of daylight between your group and the group in front of you you are out of position. Now you could have 3 holes open and still be in position. No Bueno! If you’ve ever ran a course,you will find that is what pisses players off. Especially if you are waiting every hole, Then you end up with 4 groups on any particular hole, then you get up on the group causing the backups and the music is blaring from a phone in their cart, drinking beers, cart girls come around and they are enjoying a hot dog BBQ. And then waving groups thru causes an even worse backup. The standard is keep your position no more than one hole of daylight. If you install that system I wish u luck Automated system really needs tweaking if it is to work properly.
Our course standard is 3:58. We have some groups that play faster; they’re encouraged to get the early tee times.
Standards are different everywhere. I marshaled at a course in California this winter where 4:30-4:40 was considered perfectly acceptable on weekends. This wouldn’t be tolerated at my home course…
I tell our PAs that an open hole is a red flag, but check circumstances. Is there a gap in the tee sheet? Is the group in front ahead of pace? If a group is on time we’re not going to ask them to speed up; we might ask them if they’d mind if the folks behind them played through.
It’s a juggling act trying to manage everyone’s expectations.
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Lots of different things piss players off, including having a group of jackrabbits pressing them when they’re playing at a reasonable pace. Pace of play will always be a compromise between the fastest and the slowest. Having a PoP “clock” allows the rangers and the pro shop staff a specific tool to enforce a minimum standard. Of course a slower group should let you through, but you really don’t have a right to expect everyone to get out of your way, especially on your third 9 of the day.
YOUR standard may be to maintain your position, no matter how fast the group in front of you, but that’s not universal. I can understand why you’d be disappointed with the change in policy, because it affects you, but it may help the staff and the majority of golfers to enjoy themselves more.
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Well we would agree then to disagree. Even though we are a muni, we have 200+players in our members association. I will tell you that PoP is the #2 bitch of the association having just completed our annual meeting. The #1 complaint is loss of membership loyalty tee times and it has become a free for all. With the advent of Covid tee times are at a premium, and the novice golfers coming to our course have no sense of etiquette, do not replace divots, we have geo-fense and they continually get their carts stuck on fairways trying to cross when they are told to stay on paths. It’s been an absolute nightmare because of the affordability of our course. We were the best kept secret until last year. Calling players that play this game jack rabbits because we play on average of 3.5 hours to 3.75 hours is an insult. When you have 4 groups on a par 3, because it is a very difficult hole, and it’s the 4th hole of everyone’s round is a problem for association members that have been playing here for decades. As a former ranger/starter and having been a former golf professional at 2 other public courses, the standard rule of keeping less than 1hole of daylight between you and the group in front of you is in keeping with proper pace of play. One group can cause a backup that can last up to 3 hours and exacerbate an issue as the group that has caused the issue might be on time, but the groups behind will be the ones experiencing 4.5 to 4.75 hour rounds.
I always skip groups when playing as a single and moving like a “jack rabbit”.
If the group in front is on pace, I don’t think it is fair to stay on their a** and try and play through.
Just easier on everyone
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To be fair I haven’t played as a single in like 15 years. I’ve mostly blast the range and practice facility when I’m on my own. Playing in a 2 some we won’t press anyone, BUT once you get a 2-3 group back up on just 1 hole it’s just math. Takes each group approximately 10-12 minutes to play a hole. 3.75 hours becomes 4.7 hours just like that. That’s why keeping within reason of the group in front of you is of utmost importance. 2-3 holes out and not paying attention to your surroundings is an issue. You now get 2 minutes to find a “lost ball” So 2-3 lost balls by folks that can’t keep it on the planet on one or 2 holes in a row, and spending 5-7:minutes in the flora and fauna searching and finding 6 other balls other than your own. I hope you all are seeing what I’m saying here causes an issue. The woods shouldn’t be considered an alternative to Dicks Sporting Goods. I blow one off the map, which we all do, I give it a glance, it went OB I play a provisional or drop quickly moving forward.
I’ve been golfing for 47 years and The Code has always been keep up with group in front of you. When I flight a ball into the heather, I look for point of entry and drop. Damned if I’ll get Lyme disease over a Wilson. Or, a Titlest, for that matter. Hit and move on…
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I think generally, the goal should always be to keep up with the group in front of you… but if the course has a Pace of Play and a group is matching it, you can’t really complain… They set the expectations, and the group has met them… As a faster player, it’s super frustrating, but it’s the cost of having a set pace of play.
I think it’s a delicate balance, and an interesting problem. Rushing people through the course is a bad look, but it’s really frustrating to wait on every shot for a 20 handicap to plumb bob a 30 foot putt… Honestly, I think people on both sides should try to be understanding… if you are moving slow, find a place to let a fast group play through… if you catch up to a slow group, give them a chance to speed up or let you through before getting frustrated…
Though, this is a much bigger problem on courses that aren’t super crowded… once the tee sheet is full under 4 hours is a miracle. Or at least it is in my area.
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When I was learning golf my grandfather always told me “you can be bad, but be bad fast”
There’s definitely a balance to strike. We want to be welcoming to new players, but they also need to know when to pick up and move on
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My dad was the same… but others learned differently… I’m trying to have a more open mind, and give people the benefit of the doubt… we’ve set expectations at a 4 hour round, so it’s hard to blame people for playing in 4 hours.
I second that…oh yeah one more teeny tiny thing…our muni is actually a public park owned and operated by county and overseen by the politicians. The PoP was not set by the Pro nor the Association members…it was set by a politician who is in charge of the public parks and he “heard” that 4:15 would be a great time…LOL. One more thing, he’s not a golfer and his only experience with the sport is playing in an outing…So yea…not to be political. When we had “loyalty” tee times Saturday and Sunday sheets were full and PoP was never an issue. The new fangled carts, and elimination of loyalty times has kind of thrown a wrench into the mix…and they have already lost 35 members who went to a different course further away but is interested in taking care of the association first because we tend to use the facility alot more. I guess it’s always good to hear the whole story instead of me bitching about half the story…