WHS - Needs support, needs improvement or needs shooting?

General Discussion
#27

I’ve heard of players dropping a stroke with 1 score (a good score), but I’ve never heard of anyone going back up a stroke with 1 score. I can shoot well above average and it moves me up about 0.1 for each high score. Makes sense with only the 8 best scores used out of 20.

My club is 35 + 34 = 69 and as a 16 my handicap is split 7 + 9. At times I was playing the back 9 regularly (only option) and it will pair two back 9 scores (even from 2 different courses). I am assuming I get 2 extra strokes because of the “harder” holes? Not sure if those scores really affected anything.

#28

Nothing in between the two 9 hole outings.

#29

I don’t show any indication of PCC on the app I’m using…
And yes…it looks like it is pairing the 41’s together.

#31

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So I just now see this disclaimer on the app:
" Perfect tool to manage handicaps for a group or league. However, it does NOT provide a USGA “official” handicap index."

So perhaps it is not a good indicator of the WHS?

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#32

That just doesn’t seem to be working properly. You have all the scores, you could try a different free app, either on the phone or online, and see if you get more reasonable results.

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#33

Yeah, looks like they kinda got their own version going on there tbf.

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#34

I’ve always been a great judge of how/where to spend money online… :man_shrugging:t2:

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#35

There are several free un-official index calculator online.
Free but can not be used for official index validation. I’d imagine someone had the software ( invented or copied ) then post it online.

#36

Here everything is linked back to England Golf who set the HCI. That did initially cause a problem in that rounds played in other parts of the UK (Wales, Scotland etc) couldn’t count. Thankfully that stupidity has been solved.

You either need to be a member of EG or of an affiliated club for this to work though. EG membership is I believe £40 per year so not much and the app is pretty good, surprisingly. This finally means non club members can get official handicaps I would imagine there is something similar over there?

#37

The calculation is easily done with a pretty simple spreadsheet. Its just a few steps:

  1. Calculate the differential for each round, based on score, Slope, and Course Rating
  2. Combine 9-hole scores as appropriate to make 18-hole differentials
  3. Sort the most recent 20 differentials
  4. Average the best 8 of the last 20 differentials.

That’s the Handicap Index. Unofficial calculators will probably not be able to access the PCC, but that’s been pretty rare, and has a very minor impact.

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#38

Thanks.
I’m with most the golfers I know. We just want to plug in the score number , select the golf course and hit the enter.
Most of the guys play a weekly rounds with their local club, and since they have beer money on the table, all of the weekly competition require a GHIN index, some will accept the USGA index but most will only accept the GHIN for some reason.
There should not be any deviation from one system to another one?

#39

GHIN is owned and run by the USGA. At one point, Individual State or Regional Handicapping Associations could choose not to use GHIN, to use another system, but they had to do things in accordance with USGA Handicapping Rules. If I remember right, Maryland and Michigan were two states that ran their own systems, but they were still official USGA Handicaps. With the advent of the WHS, I believe most, maybe all, Handicapping Associations in the US use GHIN. A big driver for the change-over is the PCC, the system needs to evaluate all appropriate scores on a timely basis in order to calculate the PCC properly. I believe that even pay sites like the Grint coordinate scoring with GHIN, and even issue GHIN numbers to their users. I don’t entirely understand a refusal to accept an Official USGA Handicap, and not sure where someone would get one.

#40

Long ago, there was free site which use the USGA handicap system. Online membership with guidelines. A few members were refused of their index at the check in desk for local tournament. The USGA index could be verified easily at the club house but they refuse to recognize the USGA index. Later on this free site starting to implement paid membership. A few local brick and mortar golf shops also ran the USGA system ( paid service ) without any rejection from local tournament organizations.
Besides if there is deviation of the two system, the only explanation I could think of for the rejection was this free site was offering free index at the time. Later they sold it to a larger organization and probably is defunct by now.

#41

That makes more sense, I think many organizations were resistant to most types of Electronic Clubs, even though some were sanctioned by the USGA. I’d guess that authorized e-clubs outside of the GHIN system are pretty rare now. As I said, I believe I’ve read that the Grint now provides a GHIN number for those who pay to keep a handicap there.

#42

Okay if the e-clubs provide a GHIN # for the members then, it must be paying dues to the GHIN system.
This club I mentioned had a corporate which paid into the USGA, then it used the features of the index calculating for their e-clubs.
Which also need a local physical address, a real person behind the club to apply under the same name, I don’t see anything different other than they were not paying into the local chapter and the GHIN. Maybe that was the reason why they were not welcomed?
The two large local brick and mortar golf shops which run their own USGA/GHIN memberships are no different than the previously said e-club. A physical location, application and one real person as the club chairman. Hold tournament through the season to have members socializing.
The only difference was one was paying and one is not. Especially not to the local GHIN organization. No difference now since all membership has dues and the local chapter also pay into the GHIN system to get a GHIN index, on top of the USGA index, which is over done.

#43

I attended a short Workshop early in 202, when the WHS went into effect. It was run by my local Association, the Virginia State Golf Association. They told me that the bulk of the $40 or so we pay through my club for Handicap stays within the VSGA, with only a few bucks going to the USGA for support of the GHIN system. Most Handicap administration work is done at the club and state (or Regional) level.

#44

$40 is low comparing to what we have to pay around here.
Yes, bottom line is what made the local organization rejected the e-club index ( USGA). I guess it was the fear of that wave of e-clubs to take over the local and it’s budget.
Makes sense.
WA golf membership depending on the club, from $55-$95 with the USGA index. I think the GHIN charges more for membership. Discounted GHIN if joining a local men’s club typically $85 for renewal and a bit more for new membership. That does not come with a locker.

#45

Interesting. The cheapest way to get a Handicap through the VSGA is $50. There are other levels of VSGA memberships that offer additional benefits. I just checked, and we pay $40 through our club, and because our club is a member in the VSGA, we have VSGA membership as well.

#46

You and me both…
(Actually LOL’d at your comment)

The Texas GHIN app wasn’t too onerous, though not free. Figured I’d make the money back in reduced greens fees at Wortham, then work intervened… (Cue the Undertaker meme…

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#47

I’m sure the club’s treasurer will keep portion of the dues for reserve.
Or as the cost of running the local chapter.
But $55 is the lowest fee for an USGA membership around here without any amenity besides the normal benefits.
I know there be extra fees and buy-in for their weekly mini tournaments on top of the green fees.
A lot of the guys I know quite their GHIN/USGA membership because they don’t play tournament golf much, and they could track their handicap index online.